Thomas Mabry and Reshawd Cobbs: SB Sheriff's Department Juvenile Intervention Program

Dr. Don English interviews Deputy Sheriff's, Thomas Mabry and Reshawd Cobbs from the San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department about the Juvenile Intervention Program (J.I.P.). 

The program, started in 2001, aims to educate at-promise youth and their parents about the realities of jail and prison life. It includes a day of mentoring, parenting courses, and visits to jail and the coroner's office. The program has evolved from a "Scared Straight" approach to showing reality, and it has faced challenges like COVID-19 and the closure of a female jail facility. Success stories include youth who changed their behavior and parents who reported positive outcomes. The program emphasizes community referrals, follow-up, and the importance of rehabilitation.

Juvenile Intervention Program (J.I.P.) – San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department

https://wp.sbcounty.gov/sheriff/divisions/public-affairs/juvenile-intervention-program/

Transcript

CDS SB Sheriff Deputies Thomas Mabry and Reshawd Cobbs

SPEAKERS

DonEnglish , Reshawd Cobbs, Thomas Mabry

Don  00:11

Hello. My name is Don English, Director of Children Deserve Success, and Executive Director of the San Bernardino County Wide Gangs and Drugs Task Force. And I want to welcome you to our Children Deserve Success. Podcast monthly, we will be sending out these recordings regarding all things related to child welfare and attendance, school attendance. Review Board, foster youth services, McKinney-Vento, homeless programs in our county, and the San Bernardino County Gangs and Drugs Task Force. This month's focus will be an interview with Thomas Mabry, Deputy Sheriff and Reshawd Cobbs, Deputy Sheriff with the San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department. Gentlemen, thank you so much for being here today.

Reshawd Cobbs  00:50

Thank you for having us

Don  00:51

absolutely so you know we're going to talk a little bit today about your juvenile intervention program, but before we do that, I'd like to ask each of you, give me a little background. Tell me how and where you grew up, Thomas, you could start,

Thomas Mabry  01:08

you're asking me to talk about myself, all right. So I grew up over in him, in San Jacinto. So I went through those, those two school districts. So good, good family, all that both my parents raised me up right the you know?

Don  01:27

So you come from a pretty stable, two parent home, household. I do, wow, that's interesting. And then let's talk a little bit about you, shot, tell me a little bit about your upbringing.

Reshawd Cobbs  01:37

So I'm from Compton. I was raised by my father and my grandparent and his parents. So I come from, I don't like to say just my father raised me because it was, it was a village. It was my father, my grandmother, grandfather and my aunt and uncle. We all lived in this three bedroom house with like, six people. 

Don  01:56

Wow And I can relate to that. Growing up very similar being adopted by my aunt, uncle and grandmother, so that is not atypical. But at the time, it may have been, but it is definitely not atypical. Now, um, tell me a little bit about how you started in your current field of employment.

Thomas Mabry  02:15

Oh, so I originally wasn't destined for law enforcement, like for for me, I was planning on going into the medical field. All I want to be was a paramedic on an ambulance. And I figured out how much people on an ambulance made, and I was like time to take a quick shift. So I was actually in school doing all the pre reqs to get into either a nursing program or PA program. And then someone said, Hey, you ever look at the sheriff's department before it's similar to what you were doing when you're working on the ambulance, and it's still, still that high speed lifestyle, lights and signs you're helping people? And so I took a hard look at that, also part of a tactical EMS team for Riverside, so that's where we're teamed up with Riverside SWAT team. And I was like, Ah, man, this is all you guys do, is training. We're always there for their safety component of their training. And I'm like, Man, this looks like tons of fun. I was into shooting sports, growing up being Boy Scouts and whatnot, and so it kind of took a hard left from medical field into into law enforcement. So nine, nine years later, here I am.

Don  03:23

And you know, what's interesting is now that, you know, we really talk about the collaboration between, you know, our first responders, which includes the sheriffs, of course, but then the medical piece is very, very important. All right, what you got for me

Reshawd Cobbs  03:36

law enforcement was always plan B for me, Plan A was basketball, of course. You know, I thought I was going to the NBA, you know, to reality hit in and I was like, oh, man, it's a little bit more political than what I thought, you know. So I graduated from Cal State, San Bernardino with my criminal justice degree, ba, and then, yeah, started looking for a job. San Bernardino Police is the one who actually put me through the academy, and then I latter it over to the sheriff's department in 2012 

Don  04:05

Wow. So you've been with the sheriff's department for over, 10 years as well. Correct, about approximately 10 years. Let's talk a little bit about the juvenile intervention program. And so what I have here is that is, it is kind of described as a one day at risk juvenile mentoring program with a parenting course with the goal to educate, provide awareness and set participants on the right track to success. Talk to me a little bit about the origins of the JIP Program, if you will.  

Thomas Mabry  04:37

Alright, so the juvenile intervention program started in 2001 this was a request actually by community leaders. So they're looking for something to actually help the youth that were going going through that like that, that dark path of getting into violence, drugs, gangs along those lines, just disrespectful to their parents, to kind of show them, like, where, where some of those past lead. And so, and one one of those. You know, I know we're going to get into a typical day and whatnot, but as far as actually showing, showing them the reality of what that looks like with some of the youth, yeah, 2001

Don  05:15

wow. How long have you worked with the program?

Thomas Mabry  05:18

Oh, I'm coming up on on three years in February,

Reshawd Cobbs  05:22

and I've been doing it for four Okay,

Don  05:27

tell me about the main mission of the program. How does it differentiate itself from other juvenile programs that you may know of?

Thomas Mabry  05:35

I would say that we're one of a kind. I don't know any anyone else that actually shows them the reality of what a jail facility looks like, what the coroner's office looks like, and also provides resources to parents. At the same time, I'd say it's, it's the that actual reality taking away the romanticized view of what like jail and prison stuff that Hollywood kind of depicts, where, you know, everyone thinks they're big and bad until they get into one of those facilities, but by the time they're in one of those facilities, it's too late. So this is one of those things where we actually get a hey, we explain it. This is an opportunity that only law enforcement and people that are incarcerated, that are probably not going to leave anytime soon, until they go through the rest of the judicial process like you get this opportunity. So, you know, take, take it all in, look around, ask questions. Wow.

Don  06:27

Would you like to add?

Reshawd Cobbs  06:28

Basically, he kind of covered all the points, because the the jail aspect is the meat and potatoes of the program. It's basically what that is, what differentiates us from other programs is because we have a jail where we actually can take them to and show them the reality. So, yeah, he Tom covered all of

Don  06:46

wow. And I'll tell you, you know, one of the things we kind of talked about is that it is not designed to be kind of a Scared Straight program. I thought we had that conversation, would you like to 

Reshawd Cobbs  06:57

so it so it originally came out as scared straight. So back in the day, like he's, like Tom mentioned in 22, 2   001 when it was started scare straight. That was, that was the tactics. That's what they were using. But as we, you know, we're here in 2024 now we're trying to take on a different approach. So scaring juvenile juveniles nowadays doesn't work anymore. You know, we try to show them reality and show them basically. This is what it is, because reality is at your fingertips. I use this all the time if you really want to see what's going on in jail or anywhere, you can just YouTube things, you know, yeah, yeah. And so you can't sugarcoat things no more. You got to just show them reality. And I think that's the best bet.

Don  07:40

I love that because you're talking about even in education, we need to pivot in terms of how we teach, because information is at your fingertips, and every kid has access whether some of the stuff is true or not true, as you have to really filter through. But again, Tom walk us through a typical day in the program, what activities or sessions do participates engage participants. Engage in

Thomas Mabry  08:03

Okay, so start off over and sheriff's headquarters or one of our our facilities, and we, we explain to you, hey, you're going to go through through this process. I always tell them when you know, I've recently taken over as a coordinator. So I always tell them, hey, I'm not going to yell at you. You know, your parents may yell at you. You may have had teachers yell at you, counselors. I'm on. Apparently that's not working, so that's not what I'm going to be doing today. I'm on. I want you to actually learn. I want you to experience it, hear it, everything that we're going through today. I want you to ask questions, and I want to have these conversations. So when we go through that, we started off just like as if we're going to be booking them into the jail so they get that experience. They see, you know, hey, this is where everyone comes in, through through intake. And then we have them put on a white jumpsuit over their clothes now, and we explain what the process is when you get booked in. We show them some of the intake cells, and we have them talk to a couple of our selected incarcerated where they actually start talking to these kids, then they'll see what they're they're there for, why they think they're there for. And this is where we have some of those one on one conversations, hey, what? What got you here? And then if they they're a little bit reluctant to tell us what it is, and we start trying to pull it out on a you know, well, this is what was told to us by your parents, because this is a voluntary program where parents are coming to us and we'll, we'll ask them, and we'll give them a placard where it says, you know, fights with siblings, ditches school, drugs, something like that. So, so they're wearing these placards. So as they're going through we, you know, we're able to see, hey, this is, this is why, what got them there, along with the incarcerated. So they do have some limited experience with with the incarcerated, the justice involved, where they're actually able to see those placards and talk about their own life experience. So. As they get booked in on the on like, call it booked in, they're not really booked in on their charges. And then we move into one of one of our cafeteria settings, where they have three inmate speakers that actually end up saying their life story, how they got incarcerated, the different paths that they wish they would have taken. And then they start going into what jail life is really like, and all the all the kind of negatives about being in jail. How if you thought you had rules on the outside, there's two sets of rules on the inside, just those jail politics. And then they actually see one of the tiers and how they live. They get the schedule, and then eventually we take them over to coroner's office after they experience a lunch with with the food that we have for the incarcerated there, which most of the time very bland, because you have to keep it low sodium, low spices, because you're, you're, you're building a diet for everyone in that facility, healthy diet. But most kids, they're used to, you know, tap a teal, the TAKIS, you know, the spicy food.

Reshawd Cobbs  11:10

we tell them, no McDonald's today. This is what you're gonna eat. So, right? So please engage in it, because you never know this. This could be a meal that you're going to be getting every day. So this is what you want. Well, this is a time to experience it.

Don  11:25

wow, and you know, it's interesting because, you know, we talk about how breaking bread like because kind of bring people together, but in this case, is a dose of reality. I would think Officer Cobb share some, if you could, some success stories from the program, and then what outcomes have you seen with the participant? So one, I should say, Deputy cops.

Reshawd Cobbs  11:51

That's fine. I know what you meant. One that came to mind was, I actually had a relative go through the program, and I didn't know we we went through the whole program. After the program, I was doing a follow up, and the mother, who actually brought her her son, who was is my cousin, called me and said, Hey, I know you probably don't remember me. Remember me, but do you know Deborah Cobbs? And I'm like, Yes, I know Deborah Cobbs. She said, That's my mother. And I was just like, are you serious? I was like, I didn't. I didn't know, because her last name is different. The daughter's name, she's married now. Her last name is Smith. And she was just like, yeah, that's my mother. And I was just like, oh. And I was like, Why didn't you say nothing there? She was like, well, it just wasn't her appropriate time. And but she's like, since you're doing a follow up, and you're talking to me, I can let you know now. And so I'm saying, Well, how's and I don't want to say the juveniles name, but I was asking, how is he doing? And she like, he's doing good. She was like, actually, that program. I am so glad that I brought him to that program. And not only that, he get got to see reality, but he actually got to see what his cousin was doing, you know, and that right there, I had to say, it really touched me, because I was like, man, Tom, and I, this is what we do. This is work for this is what we do, you know, we come here. We do this every day, but to actually see that this is actually making a difference, and see your own flesh and blood that that hit hard.

Don  13:17

Wow, how inspirational is that, you know, yeah, is it relates to we talk about trying to get you know youth in law enforcement, in the sheriff's department, and they don't have to be necessarily sworn officers, right? They can be civilians, yes, but so many are not exposed and don't know about it. So I think that's a phenomenal story that you share. Thank you. And because you know it's all about motivating kids and really showing them, how can they get there? Yes, right? And then changing the whole paradigm of popo. And I don't like Popo, and I tell the story as executive director of the task force, I joke, you know, we have the sheriff is the ex officio and the superintendent of schools and the district attorney, and I walk and I said, Hey, by the way, guys, I don't like popo. I never did. So they laugh, but that's the the mind, you know, shift of you know, we have to shift our minds as it relates to really understanding what the Sheriff Department and other law enforcement agencies do and how they support our community. So I want to thank both of you for that. How do you overall measure the effectiveness of the program? What metrics or feedback do you use? Now, I appreciate the example you gave us, Deputy Cobbs, but what other metrics do you use to measure effectiveness?

Thomas Mabry  14:35

I always like to think it's the phone calls that we keep on keep on getting, because we'll have parents that refer other parents where she's like, Hey, you change my kids life. We've had ones call and say, like, hey, I really think you saved my kids life where it's like they were going down, like, pretty, pretty bad path and like, now it seems like they're they actually have some dreams, some hopes. They're doing good in school. They're now on their way to something better. I mean, I feel like that's like the ultimate. Right measure of success, but then we do get those one off stories where we hear about people that went through our program years ago, and they're like, hey, yeah, I went through that program. And I'm like, you're in the sheriff's department now. And I'm like, Oh, that's pretty cool. Like, I didn't know that. Wow, yeah, we had a share of custody specialists. I went through the program, and I think they went on to become a deputy once they hit that age. But I'd say that's like a pretty good measure of success. But immediately, right after the program, you can kind of see like attitudes from when they came in to when they're leaving, not not just the juveniles themselves, but the parents like because the parents go through a parenting portion too, which is like a big thing where they feel like they actually have resources. Reach out to some, some through County School Systems, nonprofits, some, some with different church organizations. But they feel like they're not alone anymore, exactly. So they get it looks like they have a little bit of a weight lifted off their shoulders. The kids they're leaving a little bit more more respectful than when they came in, where, you know, they always have their arms crossed, acting all big and bad when they come in, like, Hey, I'm not gonna go, I'm not gonna take anyone once, one stuff right now, like, and then when they're leaving, you know, they're, they're more more calm, relaxed. Their arms are down, they're actually, you know, talking to their parents, which they weren't doing originally. So that, I feel like that, that is like a moment of of success when you see that kind of stuff

Don  16:21

 yeah, when we work with youth just over the years, I'm in my 29th year as an educator, and so often you don't get immediate gratification, which is kind of what you're talking about, but over time, you do get that, and so I appreciate you saying that, and even something as small as What we may think body language or even communicate or being receptive to what you're sharing. So I appreciate that. How do you handle and I'm sure this has happened. Well, let me back up. What challenges have the program faced since its inception, and how have you addressed 

Reshawd Cobbs  16:22

I would one of the biggest ones was COVID. When COVID hit in 2020 that's when I had just got to our public affairs division, and when COVID hit, we wasn't able to have the program because the jails were we weren't able to bring the kids to the jails. So that was a major challenge that we have had with the program. Since then we we have opened it up. Program has been flowing smoothly, but we have run into another part, because one of our jail where we take the females to it's closing. So now we got to find another resource to see how we going to run our jail portion of the program, our female portion,

Don  17:35

right, right, right. And I do want to go back to this piece too. How are participants selected for the program? What criteria do you use to select participants? 

Thomas Mabry  17:44

So when it comes to participants, this is all a voluntary program. We're not going out to schools and say, Hey, give me all your bad kids, right? You know we're gonna, we're gonna take them on a bus right now. No, this is parents that are reaching out. I feel like we've, we've both spent probably a better part part of our week on on the phone sometimes, just talking to parents about, man, what can you do? Can you just, hey, can you just scare them a little bit, put them in handcuffs? I'm up to my wits end because I don't know what to do. And then we have to explain we don't do that anymore, like we want them to come to police when they have problems, not scared, be scared of the police. So, yeah, it's all parents referrals. We'll we hand out flyers to to a lot of different schools, and that's how we select them. But as far as who's actually able to go through the program that criteria, I mean, they can't have any upcoming court dates. It can't be mandated. We don't want anyone with any serious mental illness. You know, that's one of those things that our program is not going to fix. We always encourage people to go through counseling of some sort, anything with a mental mental health clinician, but anything that's voluntary, we're happy to take it. You know

Don  18:52

what role well before I go to the next question, how do you handle resistance from participants or families? Or do you experience that? 

Reshawd Cobbs  19:01

So when you mean resistance, what do you mean? 

Don  19:03

 lets say that once they're in if, for example, let's say we go into the facility, okay, and midway through, I'm resistant to whatever, and I want to stop the tour, stop the program. How does that work?

Reshawd Cobbs  19:19

So basically, we don't, so like Tom mentioned, it's a voluntary program. We don't let the kids know it's voluntary because, of course, that's why they're there. They they're resistant towards their parents. So if their parents can't handle them, that's why their parents just brought them to us. But yes, it's a voluntary program. So if they we haven't experienced it yet, but if they do come and cause problems, then we try to persuade the kid to stay, but if it becomes some more than what we can handle, then we would remove the kid from the program. We'll bring them to their parents and say, Hey, we can't have them because we have another 10 to 15 kids that we gotta worry about. And we already know if one kid causes a problem, right? It just. Is a chain of thing. That's what we don't want.

Thomas Mabry  20:03

Yeah, and these are all 13 to 17 year old teenagers, so it's for me, I always pull them off, one on one, and then have those conversations, you know, most of the time. Hey, now this I explain again. This is a once in a lifetime thing. You can't go through our program again. You're only going to be able to experience this once, like, I challenge you to stay here. Experience it. Be respectful. Because you know what what you give is what you get. You know, we've all been respectful to you. Everyone's taking their time out of their day to you know, give you this program. Like, I challenge you to stay be respectful. Go through the program most time kids, kids go through that. Or if there seems to be something under the surface, you know, there's always those things where you're like, Hey, what's going on today? You know, having, having those kind of conversations to kind of kind of get through that program. And maybe we're just scratching on the surface, you know, everyone handles, you know, a little bit of a stressful situation. We We try and keep it, you know, a mentoring process, and not the high stress, like, scary straight. So we're scratching on the surface of something like, Hey, you know what's going on with you today? It's like, oh, you know, I, I've experienced something like this before with my like, you know, it's bringing up some Okay, let's, let's talk about that. Real quick 

Don  21:15

Trigger time. Yeah, wow. That's phenomenal. You never thought you you'd be law enforcement, clinicians, Teachers

Reshawd Cobbs  21:24

 like us, we wear many hats, many, many hats.

Don  21:27

I love it because we need it. What role does the community play in the program, and how can individuals get involved? 

Reshawd Cobbs  21:34

I think the community plays a major role in the program, because actually, the community is the one who is, how we get our clientele. I like to call it, you know, the referrals, the saying, hey, go to this program, because this program was successful for my kid, you know, and I be, I believe it's been, it will be beneficial for you. So community plays a major part.

Don  21:55

How do you collaborate? And you touched on a little bit with schools, law enforcement and social services to support the participants. Is there anything after the participant goes through the program? Or that's kind of after that? You know, I heard you say follow up, so I don't know if you do some type of follow up

Thomas Mabry  22:12

 yeah, roughly about one month or three months out, we'll, we'll give the parents a call. Sometimes we show up to to either their house or we'll go to the school, and we'll just, we call it a little bit of an integrity check. You know, how are you doing? Are you following through on, on the end? Because towards the end, we try and get them to put down the stuff that they want to be like if you were meeting me or deputy Cobbs for the first time, what would you want us to see us? And we have them race that placard that that originally had, why they they came in, they're quote, unquote charges, and now they're putting on stuff. And, you know, go to college, finish high school, get better grades, be respectful to my parents, like, you know, all sorts of stuff. Go go to a trade school. Like, they, they start putting down some I'm like, Man, I You are not the same person that I just met, like, a couple hours ago. Yeah, wow. So we'll follow up. Hey, you know, how's, how's all this, how's all that, uh, going are you actually following through with some of that stuff you put down on that paper? The better part of you that that wants to do that?

Don  23:08

Yeah, follow up is vital, because kids, you know, you know, is out of sight, out of mind, for one but two, when you come from a background that's not consistent , you're not accustomed to people following up, which denotes that maybe they don't really care as much. right? It's almost like, you know, when you walk past an individual and you don't speak to them, it's like, okay, I'm invisible. So I think that's really vital in terms of the program. And glad to hear that you're doing that. How do you see the landscape of juvenile intervention evolving in the coming year. 

Thomas Mabry  23:40

Oh, it always has to do with technology. Like, I mean, when you when you talked about the start from 2001 to now, like, 2001 there wasn't a whole lot of people on cell phones. I remember maybe the Nokia brick phones, the ones that had, like, snake on it, the prepaid ones, hey, don't waste my minutes. Don't send me a text. That's a full minute. Yeah, going from that to now you have a full blown super computer in your the palm of your hand. So it's always, it's always changed by technology. You know, we're dealing with marijuana and, yeah, methamphetamine. Now we're dealing with fentanyl, and it used to be designer drugs when we were in in high school, and now it's mostly just vaping marijuana, like not even so much alcohol anymore, like you still see that occasionally, but it seems like a lot of kids have veered away from alcohol, just it changes with drugs, with trends serving laws like so we're always trying to adapt to whatever's happening. Social media platforms like Reshawd never talks about his, uh, his MySpace app anymore. We have to keep keep up with what's going on

Reshawd Cobbs  24:51

Myspace, 

Don  24:52

Facebook too, right? They say that's only for the old folks Facebook, you know. Wow. So some personal reflect. Questions, what has been the most rewarding aspect of your work with the program, Deputy Cobbs? 

Reshawd Cobbs  25:06

Oh, rewarding. I would have to say, when I go out and do the when I get the feedback and do the follow ups, those are rewarding for me, because the kids, they never think that we're going to come, especially when we show up to the house, right, you know, and to and to have that guy that they don't even know, and he's a cop, and he's showing up and he's actually checking up on me, and to see the look on their face, and you're talking to me like, Hey, how you doing? What's going on? You take them to the side, because we always like to take them from their parents, because, you know, we don't want to break that code that we had, that bond that we had just built. So when I'm talking to them, guy, our girl, we take them to the side a house thing is going house, how housing is in the household, and when they are opening up. I think that is very rewarding, because Tom and I know dealing with people out on patrol is hard to get a person to open up. So to have this little 13 to 17 year old open up and start telling me things like they've been knowing me for years, I that's a rewarding feature for me.

Don  26:08

Wow, wow. Deputy Mabry

Thomas Mabry  26:11

For me, it's a sometimes hearing the incarcerated stories, so when they're actually giving their testimony of like, how they got there, the life that they live, and they're telling it to these group of teenage men and women, and they're, I can think specifically of a female that was telling her testimony, and these girls like the look on their face, and they're starting to get teary eyed because they're hearing her story, and Some of it is just like, I'm I'm starting to like, you know, Hey, I gotta my no problem. That's a heartbreaking story. But they're talking about their life of drugs, violence, prostitution, that of being kidnapped, and all these things that got in, got them into this, this lifestyle and like, and they she said this one phrase of like, I've already done that for you. Listen to my story so you don't have to do it. And you see these girls crying and like, dang. Like, can I get you as a speaker every single time? Because I wish I could have, could have recorded it, because it was meaningful. And she cut, she cut to the core of everyone in that room, including myself, where she's out now, and I hope she's doing well, and but, yeah, every, every girl that got to hear her talk, I think we had two groups. I got to hear, hear this person talk, and that was just an incredible story. And she, she just gave it to him straight, as far as, like, her whole life story. And those, those girls, I hope they they change their lives around. 

Don  27:43

Yeah. similar to like the students we get who are expelled, and the prevailing thought that the parents don't care, but the parents actually do care. And that's an example of another adult who's not a part of the other students families really caring about them not coming or duplicating what they did. All right, last question, How has working in this field changed your perspective on youth and rehabilitation? Now, I know you work with adults too, so I don't, I don't want to, you know, shy away from that aspect of your job, but as it relates to youth and rehabilitation, what comments do you have? Deputy Cobbs,

Reshawd Cobbs  28:22

I was going to actually this question, can actually go, go part to what he was just saying, rehabilitation, I would have to say, it's funny how when we have, when we go talk, give those three inmates and to give their testimony, they're willing. That was that that blew me away when I first adapted the program, because I was like, Okay, how are we going to get people to talk? Who's going to talk to these kids? And you have these inmates that's willing to go out there and basically say, like, Tom just said, I did this for you. You don't gotta do this. You don't want to be here. And if you do come, then I'll be waiting for you. every inmate is not bad. And I tell that people to all, all the time. Just because you're in jail, that doesn't mean you're evil person. It just mean you you have a roadblock, you know? And some, sometimes you just got to give over those hunts. It's something that you did. You're paying for it now, and when you get out. Hey, you're starting fresh and over. So that right there, I'll have to say, is one of the things that made me look that rehabilitation difference.

Don  29:27

Wow, Deputy Mabry.

Thomas Mabry  29:29

Oh, when it comes to kids, I've got to experience it in my career, like some of the best and brightest in San Bernardino and a couple other counties that come into for some of our school programs. I'm like, man, they're fantastic kids. And I, I've had the complete opposite of like, like, where, where do we as a society fail you like, because I don't like, I don't think people are born that way, where they they're like, just doing criminal stuff. And just like, I'm like, this had to be someone had to. Teach you how to do some of this stuff, because this is some, some pretty in depth bad things that you're doing, and why do you think that's okay? So as far as kids, like, I, I feel like kids are still like, a huge place in my my heart, where I'm just like me, like, there's tons of hope for you, even the bad kids, where I'm like, I want them to be better, if there's anything that I can do, like, you know, we've been a part of, like, Shop with a Cop, some of the other charity programs that are here in the valley and that are helping out, like, kids that don't have anything, and for me, like, I'm always, always one of the first people to sign up for it. But as far as rehabilitation goes, like, you know, there's, there's a lot of programs that are trying to get these, these kids help. And I just, I hope every every parent takes advantage of that so they don't end up have to go through a rehabilitation program like if they do take advantage of the rehabilitation programs that our county has to offer. So you know, kids actually have a fighting chance, then do something great, be a contributing member of society, whatever that looks like.

Don  30:58

Absolutely, I'll tell you I was when I was principal, and of course, we had, quote unquote back is the students who were expelled, etc. We did a shot with a cop. And so that really is life changing too. Because again, a lot of times people who go who have obstacles in their early life instabilities, they could have food insecurities or housing insecurities, or they could be in the foster care system. They don't have trust. And so I think those are programs that really make a huge difference. So I want to give you both a chance to if you have any closing comments. no, I just, honestly, I just want to thank you for the opportunity for us to go and display our program. I think it's a very beneficial program. I know it is because of the feedback I get, you know, and and like I tell the parents when they come to the event that we have, it's not us that's going to do the work. It's the inmates. They do all the work for us. And and get that reality aspect from them, saying, Hey, these are the real these are the real people right here. These are the real rappers. These ones the rappers rap about, right? If you want to hear the truth, hear from them. You know, you might not want to hear from me, hear from them, and taking that in that is very beneficial, you know. And so, yeah, I just like I said, Thank you for the opportunity and having us come and display our good program, we have

32:32

 absolutely Deputy Mabry

Thomas Mabry  32:40

I guess, if I could say anything is, you know, for the parents out there that are actually trying, you know, like we appreciate the phone calls, we appreciate everything, like the ones that show up for our program go through the parenting, parenting portion. I know those are the ones I truly love and care about, their their their child, but our program is not the end all be all. I always think it's the start of something. So if it's getting into another one of our community programs, working with county schools, going to family counseling, working with one of our other county partners to better that relationship with the kids. And I always encourage the kids that go through our program, is ask how you can fix whatever it is that you did wrong, and parents be receptive of like, hey, the things that happened in the past. Let's move forward  on how we can fix it, and move forward with everything that's happened in life, and just try and get your kids back onto the right path. So because these are not I even have a hard time calling on kids most time because they're 13 to 17. These are, these are young men and women like where they're they're just a couple years away from voting. Some of them are already driving some some like they're, they're there. They're already a part of our society. So, yeah, just figure out how to fix it and move on. 

Don  34:01

And I love what you said about how do we fail you? You know that mindset is really important for us as public servants to have. I want to thank you both deputies, Mabry, and Cobbs for being here today. And I want to thank you for listening. We hope you find this information valuable. If you have any topics or questions that you would like address, please email them directly to cwa@sbcss.net as always, we hope you Stay well and continue to transform lives through education.